Hello my fellow Chamingers. Some updates. Real Talk Episode #7 released today! This is a very personal episode for the host – Fabian Chagoya because he shares about having an identity crisis after realizing what was one of the things holding him back from his full potential. Make sure to listen and read the transcript to our latest episode of this Real Talk discussing why you should always be proud of who you are and if you are not happy, what are you going to do about it. Identify, acknowledge and take small steps to start changing your life!
Also, we just recorded our very first episode of Industry Darksides while live-streaming it! Another exciting milestone, since it is a series that we will be discussing the realities of different jobs and what actually goes on behind the scenes.
Additionally, we have released multiple new DAILY CC episodes – our vlog that showcases the behind-the-scenes of Chaminger and what it takes to build a brand and podcast from zero! Watch here!
Are you ready to have the real talk with yourself? It is time to listen to someone else continue their self-reflection journey and see if you can relate or do the same things. Check out the audio and transcript of our entire episode below. We appreciate you for starting the journey to #BecomingXceptional with us!
And read along – the transcript:
Fabian: Hey everybody. My name is Fabian Chagoya.
Alejandro: And I’m Alejandro Chagoya.
Fabian: And we’re the hosts of Real Talk, a show all about the journey of self-improvement and getting to know oneself in which we discuss the harsh truths related to finding success.
So Alejandro, how you doing today?
Alejandro: I’m doing well, Fabian, yourself?
Alejandro: Good to hear.
Fabian: It’s always exciting to be able to record these episodes with you and have our weekly talk. So let’s get right into it, the small talk segment. How has it felt for you doing a weekly recording?
Alejandro: You know, it’s a really interesting experience. In some small way, it’s actually something I kind of look forward to. On the one hand, I feel always like, you know, I have to always meet the standard of having a good talk here, between us. But on the other hand, it’s also some, uh, in a way kind of enjoyable just to talk, to catch up.
And then sometimes we end up reflecting on a lot of interesting experiences that we had. Especially in ways that I think neither of us had previously considered. So I think in some way that’s actually rather valuable.
Fabian: Exactly. A few things that I want to say about that. One. Before I get into what you said. For the viewers, obviously you can see some different video format and lighting quality. I’ve addressed this in our daily CC vlog, but experimenting. Same thing with Alejandro, I know he modifies things every episode.
It’s a journey, it’s progression. And it’s one of the things that I want to really call upon to everyone to focus on if you’re just listening to these episodes. Really realize that sometimes we don’t have everything figured out day one and that’s okay. You keep making improvement changes. And then you look back on where you were 30 days ago, 60 days ago, two years ago, whatever it was.
And you realize how far you’ve come, how much you’ve learned. I mean, there’s so much just with all this recording and lighting and sound and things that we have figured out, Alejandro, and this is only our fourth time doing this. I can’t even imagine where we’re going to be when we’re at like episode 20 or something like that. So, that for me is really exciting.
Number two, agreed. It’s been such a joy having this opportunity. We didn’t, we were always close, but once we moved apart, we didn’t really stay in touch as much. So this is an opportunity for us to also have a catch-up. Yeah, we’re not necessarily talking about, Oh, what’s happening today in your daily life, but it gives us that opportunity, in a way. We’re really talking about other things like the more meaningful things, the Real Talk, hense the episode.
So it’s been great. I love this. I definitely look forward to hearing about what’s going on with you and your perspective and my perspective. And I mean, we kind of knew a lot about each other, but I feel like this is where we really get to hear and see a hundred percent what’s going on.
What are your thoughts of that?
Alejandro: Very true, because as we discussed in previous episodes, there’s always the face that we present to the world. That face might depend on according to who we are speaking to, how our relationship with that person. But in a sense then, who we are as a person is still going to be entirely different. Well, maybe not entirely different, but there are going to be certain core aspects that you might not necessarily share with everyone.
As we’ve also said that sometimes even who we are with ourselves, we’re not entirely honest with who we are. That, uh, certain things we have to face, certain things we maybe think of ourselves that aren’t maybe reflective of the reality. So I think it’s a very big and important opportunity to really reassess these things.
Fabian: Glad to hear that Alejandro. So two things based on that, one, have you felt that imposter syndrome has kicked in? So obviously this is something that you’re not used to doing. It’s not your job. It’s not part of your daily job duties. Yes, you speak to a lot of people working at the consulate, but now really it’s about your voice. It’s about your communication skills. It’s about retelling stories. It’s about reflecting. It’s about sharing valuable information about your past and that’s a very different skill set than maybe you were used to doing. So that piece imposter syndrome. And two, have you felt like one you’ve become more comfortable with this and two that your skills have improved.
Alejandro: All right. Let’s address the first point there about imposter syndrome. Yes, imposter syndrome is definitely a very close friend of mine for the longest time. I certainly felt it, long time in the past, throughout my life regarding our talks that we’ve been doing. Uh, yes, to some extent I can certainly admit that there was always this concern that I had a certain expectation to live up to. That we’d have proper material to discuss, because as viewers might not be aware, Fabian does provide me with a general outlook of what we want to discuss, but much of what we’re talking about isn’t 100% improvised.
Fabian: Hey, pat yourself on the back for that.
Do you know how rare and difficult that is? I haven’t really mentioned this because I wanted to say it for this kind of moment. Most podcasts or shows or stuff like that are so scripted to the point that they have complete outline of what they’re going to say. And there’s days in advance of preparation, or for example, in sales meetings, most of my coworkers would prepare for a week and know exactly what they were going to say. Or you have a presentation that they’ve practiced 20 times before delivering it. The fact that you can come up with the stuff on the fly is kudos to your skillset, to your honesty, and also the real talk. And that was the whole point of it. The reason why I do that is because I want to make sure that it’s real, but I just want to let you know that that is something you should be proud of because most people would not be able to do that.
Alejandro: I appreciate that a lot, Fabian. Thank you so much. So getting back to my train of thought
I always try to present myself very eloquent, very informed. So, I always want to make sure I meet that standard as much for myself as for you and your viewers, because they deserve to have a proper conversation here with us, an expression of ideas. Sometimes you might see me stumble over my words a bit and get lost in thought. And maybe how I express myself might not always come across in the best manner, but it’s certainly something I’m working on.
I do agree on the second point that I feel like I’ve certainly grown a lot more comfortable engaging in this. I think it’s been a very, very good learning opportunity for me in that way. I mean, certainly it’s not entirely my area of expertise, but I mean more and more for even in work. For example, just the other day, I had to face a bunch of, um, Uh, well, not customers, well, the people who come to visit us there, we had technical issues that delayed for like half an hour. They’re like who should go up and talk to them? It’s like Alejandro, Alejandro’s the one I should do it. Because I don’t know, I’m like the very personable, very diplomatic face amongst my colleagues. As I discussed afterwards with another coworker, it’s like, yeah, they would eat the rest of us alive. You were obviously the best choice to send forward.
Fabian: How do you feel about that? That you were kind of like chosen, that they were like, yes, him and that you almost volunteered and that you described yourself as diplomatic. There’s a lot that needs to be discussed about that sentence, but what do you feel about that?
Alejandro: Sure. On one hand, it’s quite a responsibility. I mean, nothing, uh, World-changing compared to maybe some other instances that might exist out there in the world. I mean, apparently the boss checked in with everybody and that was sort of the consensus and he then reached out to me there to face with the crowd on that.
I’m always very willing to go forward and undertake these tasks, um, asked of me. And I mean, on some level, I guess as much as it was a responsibility, it’s certainly also a bit of an honor that the boss also effectively recognized that I would be the best suited for the job here, essentially.
I guess in some way, there’s a bit of pride in that. Especially considering, as we’ve mentioned, not long ago about imposter syndrome. There’s this recognition as well as personal feeling of recognition within myself that certainly I’m suited to handling this task
Fabian: Well, a few things than that, and this is going to be a confidence booster for you. I want you to realize that, for example, in my last company, a medical software company, the people who would do what you did would be either myself, so the representative for three states territory. I was the face of the company for those three states, Kansas, Nebraska, and Colorado. And then later Utah and Wyoming. Or it would be a vice president, or the president of marketing, or the CEO.
Those are the people that would address the customers. Doesn’t matter what the customer is, our customers would be addressed by that person. The person that knows the answer, that knows how to get them to feel heard, appreciated and explain the situation in such a way that they accept it. So, I just want you to realize that these are literally the top dogs of a 2000 employee company, or myself, or people that have a similar role as me, that would do it. And you’re doing that exact same thing. I just want you to realize that. Do you see how important and how monumental that is? Your customers come to you. They chose you.
Think about it in a very primal nature. Go back to the wilderness, the Sahara, the Amazon jungle. And there was like a, a tribe of people and who they chose to represent themselves to deal with strangers that approached them. They chose you, man. That’s how you need to think about it. Like biologically human race wise, if you cut out all the technology and the fanciness and the developments, they chose you as their representative.
And there’s something to be said about that. I think you need to realize that, and these are the things like I would put in my resume. Or I would use in an interview that like, Oh, Hey, this problem happened. When we had technical difficulties, my boss and my coworkers came to me to not only deliver the message, but smooth it over. That is such a powerful statement and such kudos and credit to not only your ability, your reliability, your trustworthiness, your speaking ability, et cetera, et cetera.
If I were you, I would hone in on that. I’m just trying to make you realize that there’s so many things that you probably do on a daily basis, that you have never rewired yourself to see in a new light. So think about that for a second,
Alejandro: Indeed, indeed.. Oh yeah, no, no kidding
Fabian: I just wanted to congratulate you in that, that’s impressive, that’s awesome. Let’s move on because otherwise we can spend all episode talking about that. So Alejandro, tell me how the journaling, the positive self-affirmations, the self-reflection has been going. Have you done it? Have you not? Has it been good? Tell me more.
Alejandro: Self reflection, yes. Journaling, uh, I’ll admit, I really need to do it more. I don’t know, sometimes I feel like I put it off because in some ways that’s a way of having to face, uh, to get down on paper and face a lot of these truths. I sometimes I wonder if that’s also, what’s putting me off. That I’m hesitant to-
Fabian: We are doing a lot of that during these real talks. So, I’m not even, I used to journal time. One other thing that I do that I recommend not only to you, but also the viewers is text yourself. I don’t know how it works in maybe in a Samsung, but in my iPhone, I can text myself. Literally my most texted person is myself. So notes, reminders, uh, things that I want to do, the way I felt for a certain thing, like if a moment happened.
There’s apps like on the iPhone for notes and stuff like that, but I don’t check those as much. I will check my texts as much. So I’m, I texted myself those things. So then sometimes I journal now through that rather than writing it down.
I will say that yes, we do a lot of self-reflecting during this episode, but I would just recommend to write down. Even if you don’t journal about the day, or how you felt, or why you felt that way. But if you ever feel really weird, or different, or good, you should write things down. That’s a moment to do so. And if you feel like you don’t want to face it, that’s something you need to focus on because that is exactly the thing that you need to identify, acknowledge, and you need to crush. If you’ve are like, Ooh, I don’t want to face that yet. That’s something that you need to pay attention to. You don’t have to face it right away, but you need to face it eventually.
Alejandro: I do certainly do a number of self-reflections. Since the youngest age, I was always having conversations basically with myself there. Always tending to be in my head and musing, thinking. So, I mean, maybe I don’t necessarily write down what there are certainly a lot of things that I basically end up discussing with myself.
Unfortunately much of that has been, in the past, a lot of the negative self-talk. Which is certainly something I’m am trying to work on, especially as we’ve, we’re engaging here with all this self-improving. And certainly I do read and, and watch videos related to similar topics like we’ve been discussing. So those all get me thinking. So maybe I have to just go ahead and take that final step of then writing stuff down.
One positive thing since we were obviously wanting to focus on that, the other day at work, for example, just had to be a witness for a birth certificate. So we had to do an electronic signature. Now I tend to be fairly meticulous on how I do it and make sure it comes out fine and neat. And obviously, you know, on those electronic pads, not the easiest thing to do a signature. I did it and I remember the lady there was one of the people was being attended to saw and like, Oh, you have a really nice signature.
And I personally never gave it too much thought, but I’m like, Oh, well, thank you. It was a bit of an unexpected compliment, especially since I don’t think my penmanship is all that great; it doesn’t get all that much practice nowadays. As I’m sure many people can attest, but yeah, I thought that was something positive.
Another thing that happened was, um, like we discussed the passions that we had, for example, baking. I tried a new recipe for ginger snaps and I’m like, ah, I’ll bring in some, my colleagues there, to share with them. And it was a really big hit. And especially since it was the first time I tried it out. So I was really pleased with that. And rather pleased that everybody really enjoyed it. So, yeah, that was something nice. I think.
Fabian: I love the fact that someone complimented you on something that you’re not normally used to. It’s weird, for example, when Stephani compliments me on something, it’s amazing, but it’s not the same as like, like someone who just met me complimented me. And I’m like, that makes no sense. They don’t know me even 1% of the level she does. But it’s like, someone else saw that in you, that doesn’t know you, doesn’t see you every day. Does that mean more or matter more? No, it doesn’t. But for some reason we naturally, instinctively think it does because they don’t know us. So if they think that, it must be genuine. No, on the contrary, they’re just basing it off so little information.
I want to talk about that more in this episode and down the road, we’re going to touch on that piece, but you do have to listen to that. Sometimes it’s funny how, when someone tells you something different, you’re like, Whoa, I never thought about that. It goes to show you how powerful your self narrative is in blocking good things about yourself.
So I’m glad that that kind of opened your eyes to that. And I will say this man, if someone tells you your baking’s good or your cooking’s good, pay attention to it. Because at the end of the day, we’re very primal. Even though we try to act like we’re not, we love food, we love eating. So someone says this tastes good, pay attention to that. That’s, that’s very genuine.
But let’s move on because otherwise we will be here all day, which there’s nothing wrong with that.
So I want to talk about not being ashamed of who you are and your interests. And there’s a specific thing that I want to mention, but before we get into that, I want to talk about something that kind of came up, spur of the moment before we started recording this episode, which is the discussion about glasses and bad eyesight.
I want to tell a brief story to people, I used to have glasses as well.
I had to unofficially wear glasses since essentially the fourth grade. But it was so minor, the prescription, that I didn’t really have to until eighth, ninth grade where my eyesight got to a point where it’s like, you probably need to use it for your school activities, especially if you’re further back in the classroom. I wasn’t happy with it, I didn’t like it. I mean, it was also during that time period at school and in human history, where people kind of frown upon glasses. Like, you got made fun of if you wore glasses, you were the four-eyed monster.
Alejandro: Right. Bullying was a lot more, um, uh, was different back then. Let’s just say that.
Fabian: Yep. You definitely didn’t have people buying glasses to look fashionable in the early 2000’s.
Alejandro: Oh, that’s right.
Fabian: It’s one of the things that I’m definitely trying to convey with the Chaminger brand. It’s, you know, if there’s something that is making you uncomfortable, unhappy, insecure. What are you going to do about it? Are you just going to be okay with living it every single day? Or are you going to try to change it? Even if it’s one step, one foot in front of the other, you know what I mean?
Alejandro: The other,
Fabian: Exactly. You got to make a movement to make a change. And for me, I accepted my glasses look. As I got older, it came to a point where I pretty much needed it full-time. I couldn’t really see faces if people were like, you know, two meters away, it was blurry. Yeah, you’re functional because you can see blobs and shapes. You’re not going to crash into things, because we could still see. But, we couldn’t see detail and is that a really living, when you just can see blobs and blurriness? No. So you start wearing your glasses full time. You accept who you are, you get accustomed to your new image.
But truly, it wasn’t something that I wanted to be. It wasn’t who I felt I was. So I was never truly happy with it and satisfied with it, but I became comfortable with it. And that’s really important, accepting your situation and your reality is something that I need to mention to everyone. Yes, I got LASIK eventually, but I was okay with it. I didn’t need it. I did not need it, because I accepted who I was and what I had and what my reality was. So I’m kind of curious before I get into the LASIK conversation, how you can relate to that, Alejandro.
Alejandro: I think we had very similar, uh, journey regarding glasses. I was obviously a few years older than Fabian. Uh, so let’s see, I would have gotten glasses, would have been, actually was around the same time. Like I said, I was a few years older than he was. Likewise, I was certainly hesitant to use them too much. Initially since these were, in both our cases, prescriptions for myopia. So we were mainly just for distance, we just use them periodically as needed. And that went on for a number of years until we had to renew our prescription.
At one point, a number of years later, we were at the ophthalmologist and I remember he told both of us why aren’t we always wearing our glasses. And we were like, well, the previous doctor didn’t say we had to. And he’s like, your vision is so poor. You should be wearing it all the time. I just degenerate over the years, yeah, unfortunately.
That was certainly something that took getting used to. I certainly remember for example, taking pictures back in college and removing my glasses for the photo. I mean, sure, you can say even today you might notice there’s a bit of glare from the lighting here for my glasses. Uh, but yeah, it was something that took getting used to for me. I didn’t feel as part of my identity, so I didn’t use it unless I really needed to.
I think one interesting example of that, of acceptance, is if we look at the Miis from Nintendo. I remember on the Wii, my Mii was, was as I am right now. And then, I think later on, I think it was on the 3DS by that point, I finally embraced the glasses look and my Mii character had the glasses all the time then.
So it was certainly a journey of acceptance. I mean, there was all the sort of the stigmas back in that era. Originally, and then having to move on from that and accept it for the practicality and just you are who you are and you live like that. I know in my case, I was supposedly with my astigmatism, I’m not an ideal candidate for say a LASIK operation or something similar. I know Fabian was a strong advocate of maybe looking into it on another time and maybe there’s room for that. I was certainly thinking maybe about looking to contacts, might try that out as well. Although both of us, a bit of reservations regarding a negative experience my dad had with it where he popped them in. And I think he scratched his eye like, Oh, I can’t see. And that really put us off permanently for that for the longest time.
Fabian: Yeah, let’s talk about that. What if the people who had glasses were seen by the human race like everyone else, especially in schools, as the cool kids. The people that you want to be like, everyone wants to wear glasses because then you’re a smart person. You’re the wise guy. You are the leader. I guarantee you people would probably be like trying to stab their eyes, trying to find ways to have to wear glasses. Because let’s say you could only wear glasses if you had bad eyesight. I promise you, people would find ways to ruin their eyesight to wear glasses. But because of that-
Alejandro: Wasn’t that why they kind of adopted the lensless glasses?
Fabian: Exactly. But it’s crazy to think that just because society at like mid 1990s, early two thousands was like glasses bad. It became this thing and it really influenced us. I remember whenever I put them on like, Ooh. People don’t know me with glasses, like you’re the weirdo with glasses. And I’m like, that’s so sad that I thought that way at that time. And I wish I could go back and punch myself. Like, why? You need this because it’s for health reasons to see well. what if they couldn’t hear well? And we laughed at them for not being able to hear well? It was just one of those things that you look back, it’s horrible, but I cared too much what people thought at the time.
But the funny thing is that once I had to wear them all the time, it became part of my identity and became part of my look. But like I said, I did it reluctantly and it wasn’t something I was comfortable with. And you get used to it, you can get used to anything. Humans are very good at adapting, believe it or not. As much as humans try to resist, right now during COVID and to adapting to the digital world and this new world that we live in, but we can adapt pretty quickly and adjust. So I had already adapted to this and who I was. But, I felt a lot more comfortable when I wasn’t wearing glasses. That’s who I had originally recognized myself as, and branded myself as and now all of a sudden I’m this glasses dude.
But there were certain benefits to it, people literally did think I was smarter just because I wore glasses. And you can betcha, I used that for sales. It was crazy, I would walk in with my glasses and people thought this guy knows his shit. I’m like, okay, I’ll take it. I really don’t, but I’ll take it. That’s just humans, you know?
The great Thanksgiving of 2019, I had this huge self-reflection period. Where I spent basically a full week alone. And just really thinking about who I am, what I do, my problems, my issues, my strengths, my weaknesses. One of the things that I realized and identified it as something that I was uncomfortable with was my glasses, my eyesight, and my look with glasses and I accepted it, but I accepted it begrudgingly. So I identified it, I acknowledged it, and then what can you do about it? You either have to accept it or you change it. And this is something for all issues that anyone has in life. Like any problem you have with yourself or thing that is holding you back, this is how you need to view it.
So I acknowledged it and I’m like, well, what can I do about it? I could get LASIK and I did it, I explored it and I did it. And I remember the doctor was trying to sell me super hard on it and all this stuff. Like, they hardcore sell you on it. And I’m like, I’m good. And they’re like, Whoa, you’re already ready? And I’m like, yeah. They’re like, most people have so many doubts and have to come back 10 times and all this stuff. And I’m like, I’m ready, just make sure it’s good.
They give you some medication and you’re calm and they basically drug you up a little bit so you’re not worried. I mean, it is weird to have something drilling on your eye almost, but it’s pretty harmless, cause you don’t feel anything. And then all of a sudden you see better and I’m like, Whoa! Yeah, it sucks for the first month because you have to do a lot of eye drops and you have to be on top of stuff, but it’s so amazing not being restricted anymore by something. If I lose my glasses or if I step on them or if I wake up, I need put, like, having that freedom was such a big thing.
There was also like this dark side to it. When I first got it, and this is not a bad thing, but I had people that I didn’t listen to, but I hate them for saying this. I told people that I was planning to get LASIK or that I schedule it a month out. I had this big sales conference for my company and I had LASIK scheduled for the beginning of November. Like it was a month out. I wanted to get it right away, but I had to wait. I wanted to get it before the conference to surprise people, the great reveal. That’s kind of my thing, just like the Chaminger brand, but I couldn’t.
So I told them, I’m going to go get LASIK after this conference. And then, I had female coworkers and stuff like that, be like, why are you getting LASIK? You look so good with glasses. And I was like, are you fucking kidding me right now? Like, I’m telling you this is something that I really want, it’s been restrictive. And then they’re almost saying don’t do it, we appreciate your appearance with glasses. So almost discouraging you from doing what you’re doing. They thought that they were complimenting me, but really what they were doing was fucking with my head.
If you think about that, like that’s so messed up. If right now, you told me, Hey, I want LASIK, I want to be free from this restriction and this limitation. And then all of a sudden I’m like, no dude, that’s who you are, you look so great with it, you seem smarter with it, all this stuff. Why would someone do that to you? Especially when you’ve already convinced yourself, and now they’re trying to almost convince you not to.
When I first got LASIK and the first few weeks after, it was weird, because it was almost like an identity crisis. For anyone, who’s getting LASIK, you’re going to go through this, but it’s, it’s worth it. It’s an identity crisis because I had worn them for maybe like, I don’t know, 9, 10 years now, full-time. Now you don’t have that anymore. So your brain has recognized you with glasses, that’s who you are, that’s how it identifies itself. And now you lose that. It’s like, well, who are you? What are you? People said you look good with glasses, do you look good without?
Alejandro: See? What I told you about the existential identity.
Fabian: Yup. It’s kind of crazy, everything changes, you accept it, you feel more confident, you gain into it, you build into it, you buy into it. And now if I wore glasses, I’m like, who is this alien? So it’s a progression, and I would say that was probably the hardest part of LASIK, re-establishing your identity. But, I got rid of this restriction, this thing that I wasn’t happy about that I just accepted.
Let’s say you just, for some reason, cannot kick a soccer ball. That was your weakness as a human and you accepted it. And then you underwent a training that taught you how to do it. All of a sudden it’s like, Whoa, I’m a different person. But if you can get rid of something that you’ve accepted, that you never liked, I would highly recommend that you figure that out. Because it is a game-changer. Long-term, in the top three things, or maybe top two, maybe even top one, of most life-changing things that I’ve done. I finally felt more like myself, who I really was deep down. And that’s crazy, I mean, it was just glasses. It’s not that big of a deal, but because I begrudgingly accepted it, and then I was fine with it, but because I begrudgingly accepted it, getting rid of it was such a huge life-changing confidence booster. So I’ll leave that for you guys. I’m not telling you I’m going to get LASIK, but if you’ve got glasses be grudgingly and you thought that you weren’t happy with it, consider it down the road. I mean, it’s not cheap, but it’s worth it. What are your thoughts on all of that and let’s move on.
Alejandro: I think you bring up some very interesting points about how we see ourselves and how others see us. And I mean, everyone can have their opinion of how we think other people look. Like you said, maybe they had good intentions, that they said they accepted you for who you were, but maybe in them other hand, that was how they saw you and the change, that image of what they had of you, might alter it. But in the end of the day, what matters is how you feel about it.
And it reminded me so much of conversations I had with a very dear friend of mine, who she was also very concerned, for example, about a the level of makeup that she would use. About the clothes she would wear, compared, for example, with her sister. And I said, no, you look fine just the way you are. Obviously my opinion doesn’t, shouldn’t matter for anything because what matters at the end of the day is yours. But I think you look good as you are. And as for your style, maybe your sister is, say more Marilyn Monroe, but you are more like Audrey Hepburn and that’s more your style. Just because there’s a difference doesn’t mean you don’t look good.
So I think, that’s what it really comes down to. That, while maybe, like you said these colleagues of yours had good intentions, but at the end of the day, that was how they saw you and what mattered more was how you saw yourself. And I think that was an important thing to embrace, as you said.
Fabian: Well, I think that’s a perfect summary for that piece, the way you view yourself is the key.
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